[weblacky]

You know, I'm not an electrical engineer, nor a professional in this field. I really cannot speak to "poorness" of the designs. I can speak to the fact that Fuel PSUs seem to go out REALLY quickly after they were new (compared to every other SGI) and I think SGI knew this given some ex-employee testimonials I read somewhere. So at least we can say the if the design wasn't flawed, then either the load calc was flawed or the manufacturing/parts were under-specced/faulty/fraudulent/etc..

I haven't been INSIDE my Fuel PSU yet, sparkle/FSP isn't supposed to be a "bad brand" so that's why I bring up the "under-specced" idea, perhaps they just run them too close to max all the time on the low voltage lines?

I have been inside a Tezro PSU and I can tell you that the one thing that DOES bother me in these modern PSUs is the lack of a SECOND HV Filtering Cap (money saved). Having a single cap seems very strange for an auto-ranging PSU for an expensive system. Older PSUs often contained two. Now maybe it's me and I just don't understand how things have "improved" but I understand the law averages in that two sharing a load is better than one without a backup. If the part is mistreated, misstored, aged, or slightly out of spec then there's no partner to help pick up the slack.

I see a lot of modern PC ATX PSUs (OEM PC PSU especially) as well with only a single filter cap...I'm not a fan...given very old PC PSUs seem to last nearly 30 years until sort of being an issue within the last 10 year for collectors of like IBM PCs and such, I know they can be better than they are right now. Those were built with quality parts with great margin for age and spec (doesn't mean it's the cleanest power output, but they designed those PCs to be tolerant of that output...so it doesn't really matter). I've actually "fixed" a family computer system PSU JUST by changing the SINGLE HV filter cap...not kidding. It was getting freezing and blue screens at high load..all tests ran fine (even PSU voltages). Changed the filter cap first...problem never returned since (3 years ago).

Also...ALL PSUs will die in the "fullness of time" because they contain parts with limited lifespans, every part must work or the whole thing doesn't work. If you look back into my initial posts on this forum, I question PROACTIVE maintenance vs REACTIVE maintenance (which you linked to).

So my opinion is, if you have a working PSU and it's 10-15 years old, stop now...recapp it...keep using it and likely it WILL keep going, then after 10-12 years, stop using it recap it...keep going. Caps keep things smooth and oscillating (like new oil in a combustion engine). If the semiconductors are feed the power they were designed to handle without spikes or issues, they should keep working.

I have found no real papers/research on the lifespan of a semiconductor. Inside, semiconductors are basically rock, no moving parts, no space gaps, but connected with fragile wires to the package legs and the package legs themselves aren't a stable/noble element and do break/corrode/etc...so they are the weak points.

I started looking because you see these YouTube videos of people with like 70s and 80's toy Z80 computers for kids and young adults doing nostalgia rebuilds (who doesn't like watching those, right?) and they keep going on about "bad chips". That got me thinking...why are they suddenly bad? Did they go bad or was it a power supply issue that pushed them too far, I'm also vaguely aware that lots of 70's to early 80's chips didn't use internal many/enough ESD protection diodes and so really are more susceptible to static discharge damage (today, not so much) so ESD can very much be an issue with those vintage of computers.

But is that true today? Can a power transistor made within the last 15 years be good, forever? They don't really know, from what I've read for critical environments, everything ordered about a policy for expecting/adapting to failure so boards are swapped out after X hours of use and rebuilt/cleaned and such, regardless of operational status.

We are dealing with basically high-end consumer products of the day. They have their expensive design areas and their cost-saving areas. PSUs WERE and STILL ARE, for most companies, a money-saving area..so consider the PSU to be the WORST component is most systems because it's the one place you really can cheap out because you only need it work as long as warranty exists. That's what got me into this 2 years ago. I own so many things with some form of PSU, if I didn't start learning...I'd have to throw them ALL away because I'd have no hope of keeping them operating. I'm not an expert, but I've had my successes in repairs so I'm doing better and improving with each experience.

For my SGI collection, I can see that the mainboard and video cards (yes, even the failure prone ones) were designed by designers that really thought about quality and testing. They have a huge amount of test points on them, their layout isn't crammed, and their parts are high-end for their time. I think the SGI mainboards are built very well and the designers really wanted their creations to last and also isolate damage should it occur (which I find odd as SGI didn't repair boards and give refurbs, right? So why care about isolating damaged, but looking at several examples, they have fuses and limiters everywhere to stop the spread of bad voltage and the like in case of destruction).

That's why I feel a lot of this MAY BE repairable, because their designs try to isolate a damaged section, that's good for repairability (a chance of it anyway).

But I agreed with users like Raion, that the last systems seem to have a few issues and likely that's due to a rushed tested and management push on not to bother and make it work within the design constraints they've given (make a Fuel fit into a PC case). So I do think there were compromises, but I have no idea how that impacts us moving forward other than stories from previous owners.

I'm pretty impressed with the low wattage PSUs like Indy/O2, simple and pretty darn rugged. Sure some had failures but systemically...I don't think so, good purchases.


I've not been inside an Octane PSU (other than cleaning) in any real sense. Octane produces additional voltages than a normal ATX PSU (known info) and it's odd HV pins/connector always worried me as a fairly poor power connector (Like a vacuum cleaner handle connector for the rug attachment...pins with cones...not good, long term).

But I never heard of MASS Octane PSU failures until about 4-5 years ago...so they lasted what, 20+ years? That's a great PSU if someone asked me! Yeah, sucks it's not a standard.

But I think the important thing we need to keep in mind is, SGI didn't EXPECT to go out of business and many business in a similar situation made "renewables" part of that business (like Dyson vacuums and batteries). Had SGI not failed and was still around today, who is not to say they wouldn't have a "fresh" batch of PSUs made very 7-8 years and sold them (at markup) as your SGI PSU went. They expected to sell you replacements. Just like they expected to sell you replacement service for Fans, bulbs, doors, buttons, etc...

So we're actually upset they went out business more than what they did. Now that it's all gone...users are left with what we have. So "buying a new one" isn't in the cards (which was the intention) so now we need to baby and rebuild our working ones. Yes, assuming off the shelf parts (no loss of PCB tracks/traces) you can "fix" a broken PSU, some of these parts either aren't generic or are just no longer produced (like some of these odd connectors).

But I have ZERO evidence that Octane PSUs don't just need new caps and some semiconductors and they aren't ready to go again. I know they have some odd pieces surrounding HV, that's my biggest concern going forward (I was lead to believe the breaker design for it's HV is failure prone and not gettible).

I think if an Octane PSU has click of death, it's likely that's the BEST possible failure...because it's one the PSU recognizes and does something about! That means likely it's brain and voltage sensing and all that works! It's HIGHLY likely that click of death is simply a failure secondary high-speed diode (one or more) and out of specs caps that CAUSED IT. I doubt they require much more inquiry (but I'll know soon enough).

Without promising or revealing too much, it's well known I intend to get to these things and have gotten to a few that are almost ready to sell (waiting for boxes now and getting packing material lined up so I KNOW how to pack these Indy PSUs) and I intend to get to ALL SGI stations as I OWN ALL SGI stations! I need it for my own collection (selfishly driven).

I want to offer rebuilt PSUs if I can, because right now it's not a real option, so Octane is next on my list (after Tezro) because there are only two Octane PSUs, so that should be doable. Octane PSUs are the most difficult to ship due to size though...so shipping prices won't be fun.

Right now (having not really examined Octane PSUs) I think they are tanks, sure they have some weak points, but I do not think those are issues under normal use. I will say the design for modularity is poor (to me) and they are not built for "swapping". My guess is SGI only expected a PSU to be inserted into a computer like 10 times in it's life. It's not rugged enough to have a swapfest.

Other than that, I have very high hopes for Octane PSUs. I think they will come out great and things will be good, I have no red flags in front of me that say "Octanes are trouble", nope, at least not their PSUs.

[jwhat]

Hi Weblacky,

thanks very much for Point of View.

Cheers from Oz,

jwhat/John.

[megaimg]

You know, I'm not an electrical engineer, nor a professional in this field.  I really cannot speak to "poorness" of the designs.  I can speak to the fact that Fuel PSUs seem to go out REALLY quickly after they were new (compared to every other SGI) and I think SGI knew this given some ex-employee testimonials I read somewhere.  So at least we can say the if the design wasn't flawed, then either the load calc was flawed or the manufacturing/parts were under-specced/faulty/fraudulent/etc..

I haven't been INSIDE my Fuel PSU yet, sparkle/FSP isn't supposed to be a "bad brand" so that's why I bring up the "under-specced" idea, perhaps they just run them too close to max all the time on the low voltage lines?

I have been inside a Tezro PSU and I can tell you that the one thing that DOES bother me in these modern PSUs is the lack of a SECOND HV Filtering Cap (money saved).  Having a single cap seems very strange for an auto-ranging PSU for an expensive system.  Older PSUs often contained two.  Now maybe it's me and I just don't understand how things have "improved" but I understand the law averages in that two sharing a load is better than one without a backup.  If the part is mistreated, misstored, aged, or slightly out of spec then there's no partner to help pick up the slack.

I see a lot of modern PC ATX PSUs (OEM PC PSU especially) as well with only a single filter cap...I'm not a fan...given very old PC PSUs seem to last nearly 30 years until sort of being an issue within the last 10 year for collectors of like IBM PCs and such, I know they can be better than they are right now.  Those were built with quality parts with great margin for age and spec (doesn't mean it's the cleanest power output, but they designed those PCs to be tolerant of that output...so it doesn't really matter).  I've actually "fixed" a family computer system PSU JUST by changing the SINGLE HV filter cap...not kidding.  It was getting freezing and blue screens at high load..all tests ran fine (even PSU voltages).  Changed the filter cap first...problem never returned since (3 years ago).

Also...ALL PSUs will die in the "fullness of time" because they contain parts with limited lifespans, every part must work or the whole thing doesn't work.  If you look back into my initial posts on this forum, I question PROACTIVE maintenance vs REACTIVE maintenance (which you linked to). 

So my opinion is, if you have a working PSU and it's 10-15 years old, stop now...recapp it...keep using it and likely it WILL keep going, then after 10-12 years, stop using it recap it...keep going.  Caps keep things smooth and oscillating (like new oil in a combustion engine).  If the semiconductors are feed the power they were designed to handle without spikes or issues, they should keep working.

I have found no real papers/research on the lifespan of a semiconductor. Inside, semiconductors are basically rock, no moving parts, no space gaps, but connected with fragile wires to the package legs and the package legs themselves aren't a stable/noble element and do break/corrode/etc...so they are the weak points.

I started looking because you see these YouTube videos of people with like 70s and 80's toy Z80 computers for kids and young adults doing nostalgia rebuilds (who doesn't like watching those, right?) and they keep going on about "bad chips".  That got me thinking...why are they suddenly bad?  Did they go bad or was it a power supply issue that pushed them too far, I'm also vaguely aware that lots of 70's to early 80's chips didn't use internal many/enough ESD protection diodes and so really are more susceptible to static discharge damage (today, not so much) so ESD can very much be an issue with those vintage of computers.

But is that true today?  Can a power transistor made within the last 15 years be good, forever?  They don't really know, from what I've read for critical environments, everything ordered about a policy for expecting/adapting to failure so boards are swapped out after X hours of use and rebuilt/cleaned and such, regardless of operational status.

We are dealing with basically high-end consumer products of the day.  They have their expensive design areas and their cost-saving areas.  PSUs WERE and STILL ARE, for most companies, a money-saving area..so consider the PSU to be the WORST component is most systems because it's the one place you really can cheap out because you only need it work as long as warranty exists.  That's what got me into this 2 years ago.  I own so many things with some form of PSU, if I didn't start learning...I'd have to throw them ALL away because I'd have no hope of keeping them operating.  I'm not an expert, but I've had my successes in repairs so I'm doing better and improving with each experience.

For my SGI collection, I can see that the mainboard and video cards (yes, even the failure prone ones) were designed by designers that really thought about quality and testing.  They have a huge amount of test points on them, their layout isn't crammed, and their parts are high-end for their time.  I think the SGI mainboards are built very well and the designers really wanted their creations to last and also isolate damage should it occur (which I find odd as SGI didn't repair boards and give refurbs, right?  So why care about isolating damaged, but looking at several examples, they have fuses and limiters everywhere to stop the spread of bad voltage and the like in case of destruction).

That's why I feel a lot of this MAY BE repairable, because their designs try to isolate a damaged section, that's good for repairability (a chance of it anyway).

But I agreed with users like Raion, that the last systems seem to have a few issues and likely that's due to a rushed tested and management push on not to bother and make it work within the design constraints they've given (make a Fuel fit into a PC case).  So I do think there were compromises, but I have no idea how that impacts us moving forward other than stories from previous owners.

I'm pretty impressed with the low wattage PSUs like Indy/O2, simple and pretty darn rugged.  Sure some had failures but systemically...I don't think so, good purchases.


I've not been inside an Octane PSU (other than cleaning) in any real sense.  Octane produces additional voltages than a normal ATX PSU (known info) and it's odd HV pins/connector always worried me as a fairly poor power connector (Like a vacuum cleaner handle connector for the rug attachment...pins with cones...not good, long term).

But I never heard of MASS Octane PSU failures until about 4-5 years ago...so they lasted what, 20+ years?  That's a great PSU if someone asked me!  Yeah, sucks it's not a standard.

But I think the important thing we need to keep in mind is, SGI didn't EXPECT to go out of business and many business in a similar situation made "renewables" part of that business (like Dyson vacuums and batteries).  Had SGI not failed and was still around today, who is not to say they wouldn't have a "fresh" batch of PSUs made very 7-8 years and sold them (at markup) as your SGI PSU went.  They expected to sell you replacements.  Just like they expected to sell you replacement service for Fans, bulbs, doors, buttons, etc...

So we're actually upset they went out business more than what they did.  Now that it's all gone...users are left with what we have. So "buying a new one" isn't in the cards (which was the intention) so now we need to baby and rebuild our working ones.  Yes, assuming off the shelf parts (no loss of PCB tracks/traces) you can "fix" a broken PSU, some of these parts either aren't generic or are just no longer produced (like some of these odd connectors).

But I have ZERO evidence that Octane PSUs don't just need new caps and some semiconductors and they aren't ready to go again.  I know they have some odd pieces surrounding HV, that's my biggest concern going forward (I was lead to believe the breaker design for it's HV is failure prone and not gettible).

I think if an Octane PSU has click of death, it's likely that's the BEST possible failure...because it's one the PSU recognizes and does something about!  That means likely it's brain and voltage sensing and all that works!  It's HIGHLY likely that click of death is simply a failure secondary high-speed diode (one or more) and out of specs caps that CAUSED IT.  I doubt they require much more inquiry (but I'll know soon enough).

Without promising or revealing too much, it's well known I intend to get to these things and have gotten to a few that are almost ready to sell (waiting for boxes now and getting packing material lined up so I KNOW how to pack these Indy PSUs) and I intend to get to ALL SGI stations as I OWN ALL SGI stations!  I need it for my own collection (selfishly driven).

I want to offer rebuilt PSUs if I can, because right now it's not a real option, so Octane is next on my list (after Tezro) because there are only two Octane PSUs, so that should be doable.  Octane PSUs are the most difficult to ship due to size though...so shipping prices won't be fun.

Right now (having not really examined Octane PSUs) I think they are tanks, sure they have some weak points, but I do not think those are issues under normal use.  I will say the design for modularity is poor (to me) and they are not built for "swapping".  My guess is SGI only expected a PSU to be inserted into a computer like 10 times in it's life.  It's not rugged enough to have a swapfest. 

Other than that, I have very high hopes for Octane PSUs.  I think they will come out great and things will be good, I have no red flags in front of me that say "Octanes are trouble", nope, at least not their PSUs.

Click of dead on the Octane....After this Fuel PSU, I have already my Octane PSU disassembled and a list of all Capacitors....good replacement caps around $90 for this units. A lot of them... The high buss and click of them comes from the middle board of the PSU....without schematics is hard...so far, visual inspection, nothing that show any damage or prompt to failure....will start with multimeter...this will take some time!

[jwhat]

Hi Weblacky & Megaimg,

my Fuel has a:
- PSU 430W: - SGI PN 060-0140-004 Rev B, Model GM430WTXW01SSV (from NMB Technologies - Made in Thailand)

As it is making noise when machine is powered off, I have turned it off from power (as per Weblacky's recommendation) and will take it out and do visual inspection to see if it has obvious signs of pending failure.

I will then access if I should "re-cap" or replace.

I actually have a Sparkle (untested) I got from eBay, but it is not SGI version and would likely need re-cap as well.

I also have a Mac (Dyna Comp Inc) power supply that has died and it also needs a re-cap...

This electronics repair stuff is not my favourite thing, I am a terrible solderer with limited space and getting components is not easy in oz.

Cheers from Oz,

jwhat/John.

[weblacky]

Hi Weblacky & Megaimg,

my Fuel has a:
- PSU 430W: - SGI PN 060-0140-004 Rev B, Model GM430WTXW01SSV (from NMB Technologies - Made in Thailand)

As it is making noise when machine is powered off, I have turned it off from power (as per Weblacky's recommendation) and will take it out and do visual inspection to see if it has obvious signs of pending failure.

I will then access if I should "re-cap" or replace.

I actually have a Sparkle (untested) I got from eBay, but it is not SGI version and would likely need re-cap as well.

I also have a Mac (Dyna Comp Inc) power supply that has died and it also needs a re-cap...

This electronics repair stuff is not my favourite things, I have am terrible solderer with limited space and getting bit is not easy in oz.

Cheers from Oz,

jwhat/John.

I can almost promise you...there are never signs of the cap failure..until they fail.  I've never "seen" a failed cap in that all failed caps look 100% to me unless they were like 30 years old...then I've seen them dump out the bottom.  But moden caps...they all "look" fine to me...but still need removal. 

You need a STRONG soldering iron to do snap-on terminal caps (what most HV Filter caps use).  However you COULD try using a soldering GUN from like the 80's, when that was a thing.  What I recommend is you experiment.  Show me the large filter cap label markings.  Get leaded electronics solder (NOT PLUMBING SOLDER, it's acidic!).  Take the PSU apart enough to get to the HV cap(s).  ADD leaded solder to big cap legs while heating with soldering gun, switch back and forth between the terminals for the huge Cap, once they appear molten (~5 seconds), keep heat on one of the cap legs and gently rock the cap (leverage), switch the soldering gun to the other leg, rock the other way, gently.  You'll eventually see tiny movement.  Note this CAN damage the board (I've had that happen ONCE but it's fixable) by tearing out a via.  But if done right, it's easy.

Keep swapping the heat gun on each leg, keep gently rocking, you'll hear a stretching sound when it moves.  Once you see a small progress where the leg slightly draws inward and the cap moves more. Heat the other side, gently leverage the cap in the opposite direction, see progress.  Remove heat while keeping the cap at the progressed, tilted, position.  When the solder cools enough the leg won't move back through it's hole, go to the other side and do it again. You're waiting like 3 seconds for cooling, not completely cool, cool enough where the leg doesn't move.

You're CLIMBING/WALKING up the holes by melting then just as it solidifies enough to prevent the cap leg from failing back through (losing progress), you switch sides.  You end up rocking the cap completely out while the holes for the terminals/legs are completely filled with solder (molten).  As the legs move inward you'll need to ADD more solder to take up the space.

If you hurry too much you'll leverage out a PCB Via (not good).  So go SLOWLY, see/feel the difference, when rocking the cap, between a molten (and movable leg) versus a hot but solidified leg, experiment a little.

Once you're actually removed the cap you can test if you removed a Via by melting the solder on the freed cap legs...if there is a Ring that doesn't melt...you pulled the via out...you need to melt the leg and use tweezers and SAVE that ring to reinsert into the board!  If the leg solder melts completely smooth and forms a fat leg...no rings or oddities, great you got it right!

The original holes will be FULL of solder, but they are HUGE.  The trick there is, take it outside and either use an air compressor or if you're feeling strong, your breath, and reheat the hole (add new solder if you need something for the soldering gun to touch), then when you've heated it good and molten, just get within about 4-5 inches and blow, hard, at the hole...the molten solder will fling out!  Clearing the hole.  This only works on those very large holes those HV caps got into! If the hole doesn't clear completely, reheat and ADD solder to refill it, then try again!

Now you can MEASURE the dimensions (Height, width/diameter, ~leg spacing) of the cap with calipers.  In mm, please let me know what it is, I can try to find you a good sub.  Then you an order new HV cap(s), place them in the same polarity (orientation of legs in holes) as the original cap (TAKE PICTURES BEFORE YOUR WORK).

Then when you get new caps you can reinstall them in the cleared holes, add solder and use that same soldering gun to flow it, completely but quickly.

That would do A LOT.  Yes, the other caps should eventually be replaced.  But chances are good the whine will be gone and the filtering will be MUCH improved.  This may buy time...how much...unknown but it's a big initial replacement...which is good it itself.  That MAY give you the confidence to go further but the biggest issue with modern PSU is you really NEED a desoldering sucking gun for moden PCB caps and the wires and caps will be intertwined and it's easy to met wires while working. The big cap are just so big that a soldering GUN will work on them...not much of anything else.

Also Fuel won't be too long in my list. I realize we're in different countries but we'll figure something out.  In the meantime I'd just get a Fuel adapter and a USED supply that tests good in a PC for a few days of test and you're good for a few years.

Let me know what you end up trying :-)

Oh, I should also mention, PSUs have a white silicone stabilizer inside them that glues things together.  The trick with that stuff is using a hot knife (or a heated/dull exacto blade) and melting through it.  It melts around 400F (little to NO smoke!).  You may have to "cut" your HV caps out of it.  It's mainly used for shipping and transport.  You don't NEED it for actual use...just bumps and movement (like in the shipping container).  So you'll need a plan if you see that stuff on your HV caps, it needs to be melted apart (like slicing through a cake with icing).

[jwhat]

Hi Megaimg,

thanks for posting the picture of the Sparkle internals.

Here is the PC version (of top board):



Note that asides from wire colour difference, the SGI version has small circuit board which is connected to fan, while the PC just has the fan directly connected to board.
I think the bottom board is the same for the PC & SGI versions (at least visually they look the same).

Could you take detailed picture of the fan circuit board and its wiring.

Also could you post picture of the wiring set that is coming from the power supply.

The PC version has:
1 x 24 PIN Molex Power
1 x 4 PIN PCI bus Power
1 x 8 PIN Molex Power
4 x Molex Disk Power Cables

Thank you.

Cheers from Oz.


jwhat/John.

[megaimg]

Ok guys, After couple of days waiting for parts I was able to recap completely the Fuel PSU from Sparkle Power Int. Model FSP460-60PFN. Issue with it, sometime was felling on the 12v rail, will go lower at 10.2v. After open the PSU, and inspection, a good amount of capacitors where bulging already. I decided to replace all of them. Now the power is perfect on all rails and the system is back online



To see photos of the Process: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1...sp=sharing



Cap List:
From DigiKey - 565-2789-ND  - 2 Units

From Mouser
Mouser #                             Qty.
80-ESS476M016AC2AA            1
647-UKA1V330MDD1TD           2
647-UPM1H100MDD1TA           3
647-UMV1E4R7MFD1TP           1
647-ULD1H220MDD1TD           1
647-ULD1H2R2MDD1TD           1
647-UPW1A681MPD6TD           1
647-UVY1A102MPD                  1
647-URZ1H470MDD1TA            3
647-UVZ1V331MPD1TD            1
647-UBT1C222MHD1TN            2
647-UVY1A472MHD                  1
647-UVZ1C101MDD1TA             2
647-UVY1C332MHD                  6
647-UMA1C220MDD1TP            5
710-860020672001                   2

[jwhat]

Hi Megaimg,

nice job, glad it worked.

This gives two options for Fuel PSU repair as per your original thread title (Re-Cap or ATX Power + Kuba ATX adaptor).

A potential third option is to create a replacement fan controller which could be retro-fitted into power supply.

Any chance of you re-opening your power supply up and
- taking pictures of the fan controller board and
- picture of fan model to confirm if this is 3-Wire fan or same 2-Wire fan I found in my PC version of Sparkle PSU,
- picture of wiring loom

I would not be surprised to find the same controller board in my 430 watt NMB / SGI PSU.

The Kuba ATX adaptor simulates the fan monitoring signal, so it would be nice be have option that allows fan monitoring to be maintained.

Cheers from Oz,

jwhat/John.

[megaimg]

Hi Megaimg,

nice job, glad it worked.

This gives two options for Fuel PSU repair as per your original thread title (Re-Cap or ATX Power + Kuba ATX adaptor).

A potential third option is to create a replacement fan controller which could be retro-fitted into power supply.

Any chance of you re-opening your power supply up and
- taking pictures of the fan controller board and
- picture of fan model to confirm if this is 3-Wire fan or same 2-Wire fan I found in my PC version of Sparkle PSU,
- picture of wiring loom

I would not be surprised to find the same controller board in my 430 watt NMB / SGI PSU.

The Kuba ATX adaptor simulates the fan monitoring signal, so it would be nice be have option that allows fan monitoring to be maintained.

Cheers from Oz,

jwhat/John.

I can confirm is a 3 wire fan!
If you go to the picture link, Picture 5 you can see the fan Brand and Model!
Nidec Beta SL - Model D0BT-12PU A
I dont want to re-open it right now...let me enjoy my new toy! I will try to take picture Soon!

[jwhat]

Hi Megaimg,

sorry, missed the fan pic as it did not show in preview.

the difference is:
- SGI - D08T-12PU A (3 Wire)
- PC - D08T-12U (2 Wire)

Understand about not wanting to re-open, I will pull mine out at some point and see what it has inside ;-)

Cheers from Oz,

jwhat/John.