[lunatic]

Everyone's crying about all of the loss of life, but I challenge you to check Worldometer to see by how much the world population has grown so far this year!!! (WE NEED TO START REDUCING NUMBERS!!!)

This world has finite resources, and this largely idiotic human population cannot be allowed to continue to grow without restraint!

This is my belief, and you can argue the subject with me to your hearts content, but only about 10% of the current human population are actually needed, the rest are all just a burden to society!

Out of all the creatures on Earth, we are the only ones that harbour the weak among our ranks, and as a result, the human race is becoming more stupid by the day!

We are told it's a good thing, but I tell you, "Weakness is not a good thing ever!!!!"

What man needs more than anything, is a single objective, a focal point if you will! Like we had in the days of Babylon! (At the moment, all that exists is the rat-race, and man is going nowhere!) There must be a plan for the human race!

We're almost at the level, technologically, where we can recreate ourselves as we see fit (selecting only the best genes for our offspring), but this cannot be achieved with 7 to 8 billion of us on this planet!

Look... I'm German. Don't lecture me on fascism.
Even the Führer will tell you: Fascism leads to the Downfall:

[commodorejohn]

I mean, there's enough in there to warrant a whole separate thread, but, uh, yeah, wow. Suffice to say that A. we've been increasingly selecting for intelligence-dependent traits (in the general population, anyway) ever since we moved from being a primarily agrarian society to a primarily industrial society towards a primarily technological/service-economic society (if not before that - it takes more than just dumb muscle to run a farm successfully,) so if people are getting dumber it's due to social/educational and not innate/genetic factors, B. it's funny how everybody who argues that "the weak should just die so the rest of us can thrive" always manages to define "the weak" as "not me," C. even laying aside the ethical considerations of eugenics and the essential impossibility of implementing it on a human population without being some variety of ethically monstrous, our track record at selective breeding for adaptability and long-term survival sucks big time (just look at what we've done to even working domestic dog breeds, let alone the poor little mutants we've bred for fancy,) and D. we have never, ever, at any point in history had "a plan" for the human race on anything more than a local scale, where we have it's inevitably fallen into chaos and ruin, and most of our greatest achievements have come during/out of the greatest periods of strife. Human beings never have been and never will be nice orderly little worker insects under the direction of a self-appointed master caste.

[Raion]

I don't think Irinikus was advocating National Socialism, to put it lightly. He was saying that the world is overpopulated, and he believes that the less intelligent will be the first to go.

I don't agree with the statements that the earth is overpopulated, mostly because resource utilization isn't anywhere near 100% and society can definitely scale up it's efficiency and food security far more than we do now.

I'm also somewhat with Commodore John on this. Regardless, let's return to the focus.

Lunatic, are you from Germany or Austria out of curiosity?

As far as the plagues and such that we will face in the future, I think worse plagues are to come. I hate to be the pessimist, but antibiotic resistance and more are catching up with the world and we have some cases that are simply out of control.

People wonder why I'm religious. Without faith in something, it's hard to go on.

[Irinikus]

I find it interesting that people always tend become political. Just remember that politics only exist in the current scheme of things, to make the little guy think he has a say! The Biggs do what they want anyway!

Let me ask a simple question: If you want to build a house, what’s the first thing you need?

Most people answer: “Money”

But this is incorrect!

The first thing you need is a plan!

Once you have a plan, then you can look at the resources you have, and the resources you still need to acquire in order to build and complete your house!

This is the basic principle of goal setting, and any success person or company sets goals! If the human race is to be a success, then the same principle should be followed!

You can’t go anywhere, if you don’t know where you’re going.

What’s the plan for the human race?

Right now, it’s every man for himself, and this is leading us to nowhere but destruction!

Just look at the world your living in!!!

How much longer do you really think this will last?

Guys, please start to think logically, like the intelligent people you are! Unintelligent people generally tend to think with pure emotion!

Just one more thing, when I referred to “useful”, I was referring to those who actually contribute. That should definitely include everyone here!

[Raion]

Easy easy, I get this is a topic we're all passionate about it; and I respect your reasoning. It's certainly consistent - as far as your view goes, you've clearly thought it out. What most people lack is moral and physical consistency. If you can form a coherent moral and physical consistency to beliefs, then it cannot be attacked as "wrong" only disagreed with in moral or methodological grounds.

Morality and what's best for humanity has no "right" answer. There's several answers that can fit the keyhole, so to speak. Mine is simply that all people are of equal importance, so if a person in Africa or SE Asia has seven kids, I am at least entitled to have as many as they do without fear of judgment or reprisal.

We cannot simply extinct humanity, so what's likely to happen is that technology will need to fill to fit the void of feeding humanity. We are a crazy species, but we are a species of also great accomplishments, and we always seem to get by through even razor edge means. See things like the Cuban Missile crisis, or the Chornobyl disaster. These will continue to happen, but just before we are all doomed or even more damage is caused, it'll get by through the skin of our teeth. Beyond that, I have to trust the gods. Not going to preach to anyone here, but that's how I maintain my sanity in the face of the times I live in. I have nothing else.

[commodorejohn]

Just one more thing, when I referred to “useful”, I was referring to those who actually contribute. That should definitely include everyone here!

Okay, now what about the people I care about? I know two severely handicapped people who will never be productive or "useful" in a broad societal sense, and will for their entire lives require care that they will never be able to pay back; one of them is my own brother. Should they die for some abstract "greater good?"

[Irinikus]

Now back to the subject of the virus!

My biggest problem here has been the reclassification of deaths to COVID-19!

Can you really trust the numbers they’ve putting out?

Therefore, in my opinion, people are overreacting, as this would only truly be a threat, if the population growth rate went into the negative, as a result of the virus, and this is not what you are seeing!

Most people simply don’t understand the scale of the economic mayhem that’s about to befall us!

In the US, for example, what happens when the stimulus cheques stop and you still don’t have a job, and the forbearance on your mortgage comes to an end? You will loose everything!!!!

---

Just one more thing, when I referred to “useful”, I was referring to those who actually contribute. That should definitely include everyone here!

Okay, now what about the people I care about? I know two severely handicapped people who will never be productive or "useful" in a broad societal sense, and will for their entire lives require care that they will never be able to pay back; one of them is my own brother. Should they die for some abstract "greater good?"

There’s a big difference between handicapped people and those who willingly underperform!

[Raion]

Okay, now what about the people I care about? I know two severely handicapped people who will never be productive or "useful" in a broad societal sense, and will for their entire lives require care that they will never be able to pay back; one of them is my own brother. Should they die for some abstract "greater good?"

FWIW, I also have family who are invalid, with acquired mental handicaps. Schizophrenia, severe bipolar, other mental illnesses. I don't see any point in a belief that relies on abandonment of the handicapped, especially those who are able to enjoy life. Despite great hardship, a lot of people who are handicapped do enjoy life. That is something that reminds me of humanity. Your brother does at least enjoy life I hope? I feel terrible when I hear stories like yours. 

Without saying too much negative in the same breath, I've also watched as some people who I grew up knowing were selfishly kept alive by their caretakers, who suffered every waking moment. Watching my classmate's brother who was 7, having the body of a three year old, and having hundreds of painful seizures every day, who suffered for five more years under his parents' selfish desire. His sister, my classsmate, confided in me she only wanted to let him die. He was miserable. He never got to laugh or smile. He was constantly in pain his entire life, and I'd compare him to a deer who was being hit by a car every 10-15 mins and having to relive that hell every day. I do not think it's a kindness to keep those alive. That borders on sadism and malice.

[commodorejohn]

Oh, he's plenty happy; he has enough of his faculties to be able to enjoy life and thanks to my parents' care and devotion he doesn't have anything much to worry about. He's just never going to mature mentally or emotionally past the point of being an overgrown toddler, let alone be a productive member of society.

[Raion]

That's good to hear. As long as he can be taken care of and and he isn't in any emotional or physical pain day in day out, then that's what matters.

There's apparently proof of taking care of the disabled back to the prehistory era, with a girl's skeleton being retrieved from the Arabian peninsula that showed that she was heavily physically and mentally disabled (I believe the term would be cretin?). Someone cared for her though, because they fed her dates (they found cavities with pieces of date in them) and that skeleton was thousands of years old.