CO-FSCK-ID
#91
RE: CO-FSCK-ID
(12-04-2020, 03:51 AM)lunatic Wrote:   It's a complex system with complex interactions. There are likely no simple answers, unless you want to go full authoritarian police state. That's what I mean. Seeing police disband protest rallies because protesters won't wear masks and stuff; that's the kind of stupidity that hurts us all. I just don't want to see the government being able to do this. I don't want the government to just collect location data from mobile phones. 

I'm not for a dystopic and repressive system of governance, but I implore you to do your own research into the riots and protests in the US.

They are neither, as the partisan media outlets claim: "Peaceful protests against systemic racism." Nor "Mindless rioting spread throughout the cities of the US."

In my states capital they tore down a statue of Christoforo Colombo, which was paid for by Italian-Americans, and threw it into the James River. They didn't care about the nuance. They just wanted to cause destruction. Meanwhile the famous "Monument Avenue" was loaded with trash and the only undamaged/not removed monument was to a minor black tennis player who died of HIV in the 1990s. 

In Wisconsin riots caused a 17 year old guy to nearly get run down by convicted felons and pedophiles working for a decentralized network of anarcho-communist and socialists which will not be named and he had to open fire on two of them, which is protected under "Stand Your Ground" in that state, yet he's being charged with murder. 

People are tired of lockdowns not because of lockdowns, but because the elite get free passes because they just need their previous spoiled little babies to riot about whatever MSNBC declares to be the great evil. The majority of the rioters are either the scum of the earth anarchists, or rich upper class white kids who think they're revolutionaries. If the protests were actually peaceful, unlike propaganda claims, or if the police did their job and dissolved it, I'd guarantee that the public would be a little more sympathetic. 

What I'll close with is unlike Germany or other European countries the constitution severely curtails the federal (top-level) government in authority to limit people's rights, short of martial law. That means a nationwide lockdown, while the military and states may listen and cooperate, it won't hold up in our courts. This is clearly a state-by-stste issue, and dare I say each state almost has as much carte blanche as each country of the EU. And judges can and will issue injunctions with lightning speed. I don't expect everyone outside of the US to understand, but for all my misgivings about it, we do have a far better legal system than some countries (looking at the Commonwealth nations) and that protects us decently so.

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12-04-2020, 01:59 PM
#92
RE: CO-FSCK-ID
I actually meant the anti-COVID-measures protests here.

I am not quite sure what to make of the various rallies and protests in the US in recent months. But you are right in the way that I certainly can't understand this FOX news lifestyle. The world and its problems really look quite different from over here. From over here, the current state of the US looks... well... strange and unstable. Unless it boils down to some actual fact that could be discussed, I would rather not comment. I am sticking to the things I actual know something about. Over here, we don't have a lot of expectations anymore. Any day the US don't nuke Belgium is a good day.

This is not to say that I wouldn't enjoy reading a healthy discussion. Please do discuss this in a civilized manner and I'll keep reading. I just don't quite get this world view.
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12-04-2020, 03:47 PM
#93
RE: CO-FSCK-ID
This is getting a bit OT but if you want a larger US discussion I don't mind sharing more of the "american experience" in private messages.

As for the actual diet of news I consume, it's pretty diverse as I seek to find the truth, and our news cycle is incredibly partisan. The world we live in here in the US is incredibly volatile, and people genuinely can and do hate each other over things like where in the US you are from (See Colorado, where they don't like Californians or Texans) or where you lay within the overton window. It's all because we don't have a unified culture to really grab onto.

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12-04-2020, 05:07 PM
#94
RE: CO-FSCK-ID
Thanks. I'm just not much into hate. It doesn't help anyone and things like love or hate can change for little reason. It's like hating an ex-girlfriend. Doesn't get you anywhere. If you don't like her anymore, congratulations, you won't have to see her anymore. Then you move on. And if you can't let go of your hate, then you have a problem that you need to address to find your balance and happiness again. Sustained hate is often just the result of an inability to face and experience grief.
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12-04-2020, 09:13 PM
#95
RE: CO-FSCK-ID
Yeah I can agree. The reason for instance why Coloradans do not like Texans or Californians is due to feelings of being "Colonized" and the cultural clash of immigrants from California into Colorado, and the resultant changes in the feeling of the place. Same with Idaho, Utah, Nevada, Arizona etc. People are leaving the West Coast in droves. California included, and this is inducing demographic shifts that drive resentment.

To try and give a European example... imagine that suddenly all the rich upper class educated people from, let's go with Stockholm just because, started flooding into Bavaria, especially smaller cities like Passau or Hof, don't bother learning German, especially local dialects, and just treat the place like they're tourists. That's the feeling of the Middle Americans in places like the midwest and surrounding states of the coasts when people move inwards, and similarly when people move from big cities to small towns and take those ideas and cultures of the big city with them. For instance, and this is just an example:

The business I work at sells guns. We've had big families move in from Northern Virginia, especially Fairfax, Arlington, Alexandria etc. Big cities surrounding DC. Big rich upper class elite places. They will get shocked when we sell guns AND we've had people staying at the nearby hotel rubbernecking at them bringing in guns to buy or sell and then calling the cops on them because "white man with a gun" or they'll come in and express their displeasure at the "redneck podunk town and the owners selling guns." and because of their disrespect they're not gonna get any ammunition, knives, gold or silver from us, let alone a firearm. Making generalizations like that aren't just potentially ignorant and hurtful to those who actually like the town (I myself am mixed on the town I'm in!) but it just doesn't endear you to them when you complain about there not being a starbucks or about the lack of a Kebab or Korean BBQ joint. We're in the middle of nowhere. Do you really expect people in their 80s to enjoy bibimbap for the first time when their most adventurous meal has been "Chicken fried steak" (For those outside of the US, imagine a minute or swiss steak breaded and fried like schnitzel. Not my thing but people eat it. Give me Becki odrezak any day.) ?

There's just a disconnect. It's probably less of a thing in a country like the UK or perhaps the Netherlands.

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12-05-2020, 12:13 AM
#96
RE: CO-FSCK-ID
(12-04-2020, 01:38 AM)lunatic Wrote:  "European Economic Area". Maybe that's your source for the "Wuhan virus". A news site that can't even look up "European Union" on wikipedia.

I don't see what's wrong with that? The EU and EEA are related but separate entities. The GDPR applies to the EU as well as the EEA. Given all EU states are EEA states, but not all EEA states are EU states, it makes sense. Perhaps you should read the Wikipedia article about the EEA for yourself.
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12-06-2020, 01:15 PM


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