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An SGI newb's questions - Tech_and_Music - 08-06-2020

Hi everyone, I'm Daniël, also known as Tech&Music on several classic computer forums. I'm 21, turning 22 this year, and I'm as you might guess into old computers. My "first love" was a Commodore 64 at age 9, and I've collected a few more of those, as well as several older home computers, PCs and 68k and PowerPC Macs since.

SGIs have always been interesting to me, and many years ago, I almost got one. At the thrift shop I frequently visit, somewhere in 2012-2013, there was an O2 of some kind in the computer area. I was really curious about it, and pretty interested in getting it. That thrift is in a fairly industrial area near the Northern harbour, and I do know they tend to get a lot of business e-waste, as evidenced by the occasional rack gear and thin clients they have for sale.

My memory is a bit hazy, but I do remember it having an A/V card installed as it had composite video jacks on the side, and it was like €20. However, it was fairly beat up and cracked. For some reason, my dad decided to try and talk me out of it, and for some more bizarre reason, it worked and I left it there, where it was scooped up by someone else. My dad never really bothered with my computer hobby, and I was (and am) pretty hard-headed when it comes to that. I guess he figured it was probably broken as it was beat up, but still, at what I think it was priced at, it would have been worth grabbing regardless.

It's something that I never really have been able to let go, and still pains me everytime I see people post about their SGI computers. Now that I have more income, I'd still like to get back at myself for that and buy an SGI machine of my own. Well, that, and I have an in-need-of-PSU-repair Quadra 700, so as a Jurassic Park fan, that pretty much requires some sort of SGI to go with it. Crimsons and similar sized other machines are out of the question, and because of that thrift shop incident, my mind is still on an O2.

I'm currently doing some orientation on what I "need", spec-wise, out of an SGI. My interest would be in doing (SD) video editing from and to analog (and maybe digital) tape, and other creative photo/audio software, next to just having fun with 3D demos and such. I've never 3D modelled, but if I ever get into it, I don't think I will need a lot of graphics horsepower. So I don't need or really want the highest end machine possible, but I don't want a machine too slow/weak to work with such programs. So far, I've looked around a bit, and I think I might go with SGI Depot to buy my O2 from. Prices seem relatively fair, specs can be chosen, and it is from a place run by someone with good knowledge on these machines.

The specification that I was thinking about, is reference 29 on his O2 page. It consists of an O2 with an R10000SC CPU @ 195MHz, 1MB L2 Cache, 512MB of RAM spread over 4 banks, a 36GB 15K SCSI HDD, the A/V card, and an O2Cam, which is something I would like to go with it. Is this for my use case a good spec'd machine? Is there anything I should change? And does 2 vs. 4 banks of memory matter for performance, or is 2 banks only better for allowing for future upgrades?

Like I mentioned, I am not rushing to buy a machine (although if I do go for SGI Depot, I'd like to buy before mid-December due to the whole Brexit thing), so I would really appreciate to hear from more experienced users whether I'm on the right track.

An Indy with accompanying Indycam is also really appealing to me, as I want to build a shelve to house multiple pizzabox style machines (already have a 68k Mac Quadra 610, and PowerPC PowerMac 6100 to go into that) of various computer architectures. However, I think it would be wise to make this a secondary machine, and aim for somewhat lower (but not anemic) specs on it. But that would be for later.

Any advice is greatly appreciated, and I do apologize for the somewhat drawn-out post!

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - Raion - 08-06-2020

We don't really do price appraisals here. Such talk is really discouraged; checking the marketplace rules section will tell you how to post a wanted ad and what information to include in it.

That being said you're talking about the O2. It's a decent first machine but there is some caveat emptor because the plastics tend to be brittle and you need to make sure that the seller is aware of how to properly pack it.

The octane is the other primary entry-level system I recommend because while it is more expensive and heavier they tend to be incredibly reliable and they have immense upgradability on their side.

Welcome to the forums and please let me know if you have any questions.

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - Irinikus - 08-06-2020

If you buy from Ian, you're pretty much guaranteed to receive the system in one piece, as his knowledge when it comes to packing these things is exemplary!!! (O2's are extremely fragile little machines!!!)

Take note of the section that I've encircled in red:



I would definitely go with the system marked 13 on the list if I were you, as it's definitely the best value for money!

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - Raion - 08-06-2020

Indeed, that's kind of the "premium" asking price, and Ian often is generous when it comes to preloading software and the like.

There's nothing wrong with that, and just as easily you can find O2s for much less. Just keep your expectations realistic, do market research and set a number you're willing to pay for.

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - Tech_and_Music - 08-06-2020

(08-06-2020, 06:31 PM)Raion Wrote:  We don't really do price appraisals here. Such talk is really discouraged; checking the marketplace rules section will tell you how to post a wanted ad and what information to include in it.

Apologies, that is not what I intended my post to come across as, as I'm more looking into advice with regards to the specification side of things, rather than price. I'll definitely take note of marketplace prices though, both here and on other online sites where these machines are sold. 

(08-06-2020, 06:37 PM)Irinikus Wrote:  I would definitely go with the system marked 13 on the list if I were you, as it's definitely the best value for money!

Thanks for the tip! I missed the modded CPU information/specification, that definitely seems like a better option.

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - Lady Serena Kitty - 08-07-2020

My first SGI was my Indy. I'd say it makes a fine machine for your first SGI. Yes it's slow, but quite well built. It's easy to get into and all the hardware is very easy to see once you're inside. I took mine with me when I went on that road-trip to Montana last year.

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - BackPlaner - 08-07-2020

(08-06-2020, 06:37 PM)Irinikus Wrote:  If you buy from Ian, you're pretty much guaranteed to receive the system in one piece, as his knowledge when it comes to packing these things is exemplary!!! (O2's are extremely fragile little machines!!!)

Take note of the section that I've encircled in red:



I would definitely go with the system marked 13 on the list if I were you, as it's definitely the best value for money!

Another vote for Ian, I've gotten quite a bit of stuff from him over the years and he's always been extremely professional, reliable, and friendly.

Oh, and welcome to the forums!

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - Intuition - 08-07-2020

I'd get at least a 300mhz r12k O2. I have both 300 and 400 mhz o2. The 400 I have seems significantly faster/snappier than my 300. Though even a single proc 195mhz Octane 1 is snappier than them both as I started with that and upgraded to a dual 400mhz proc for the Octane. Now its very very snappy and is a pleasure to do 3d in considering the era I am using.

I wouldn't want to try any slower than 300mhz r12k o2 proc.

I have been doing 3d Animation for a living since 1995 so I am going to be a bit more picky about machine snappiness than most in this consideration for use old SGI for retro CGI uses.

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - drmadison - 08-07-2020

I'd say that a 195mhz O2 is a perfectly fine starter SGI. I wouldn't go with an Indy as while they have that oldschool pizzabox unix "cool" to them... they're SO MUCH SLOWER. An Octane would be notably faster, and much more upgradeable, but also a lot bigger, heftier, and just more you have to know. Plus if you're wanting to do SD video, the O2 is literally the machine MADE for that, unless you want to go Octane + video option boards which will all add up to quite a bit more money.

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RE: An SGI newb's questions - Tech_and_Music - 08-07-2020

Once again, thanks for all the comments and the welcome!

(08-07-2020, 12:42 AM)BackPlaner Wrote:  Another vote for Ian, I've gotten quite a bit of stuff from him over the years and he's always been extremely professional, reliable, and friendly.

Oh, and welcome to the forums!

Ian definitely does look like the way to go! Unfortunately though, I just noticed (I'm once reading over fine details here) Ian is currently out of all R10K/12K O2s, so at present I wouldn't be able to buy one there. Here's hoping that in the meantime while I'll set money aside for the modded R12K 300MHz model, he'll get in some more parts to start taking orders for those again. It's still convenient to be able to pick out a specific set of specs and peripherals, and buy with some form of warranty, the knowledge that the seller will pack it well and has intimate knowledge of what they're selling, and the overall service (which so far, my impression of has been very positive by the mentions of Ian across SGI related sites and content online).

(08-07-2020, 12:10 AM)Lady Serena Kitty Wrote:  My first SGI was my Indy.  I'd say it makes a fine machine for your first SGI.  Yes it's slow, but quite well built.  It's easy to get into and all the hardware is very easy to see once you're inside.  I took mine with me when I went on that road-trip to Montana last year.

(08-07-2020, 06:08 PM)drmadison Wrote:  I'd say that a 195mhz O2 is a perfectly fine starter SGI. I wouldn't go with an Indy as while they have that oldschool pizzabox unix "cool" to them... they're SO MUCH SLOWER. An Octane would be notably faster, and much more upgradeable, but also a lot bigger, heftier, and just more you have to know. Plus if you're wanting to do SD video, the O2 is literally the machine MADE for that, unless you want to go Octane + video option boards which will all add up to quite a bit more money.

The Indy is definitely a cool system, but it would be perhaps a system I would try and find a cheaper model of later, as a secondary machine to the O2. Maybe getting an in-need-of-repair one to fix up would be fun.

I know that NIDEC Indy power supplies tend to go bad. I was just curious, what goes wrong on them? I'm not shy of solder work, either through hole or SMD, so getting an Indy with a dead NIDEC PSU on the cheap could be an interesting option. But I think I'm getting ahead of myself here  

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